247.887000 Questions (Tecumseh 5hp 22") - Snowblower Forum : Snow Blower Forums
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post #1 of 11 Old 02-10-2016, 10:38 PM Thread Starter
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247.887000 Questions (Tecumseh 5hp 22")

I realize this is a Craftsman snowblower sub forum and that there are many 247.xxxxx threads in this sub forum. I have searched but have not found exactly what I'm looking for.

For reference, this is probably an ideal ownership situation. As a hobby, I am extremely mechanically inclined. I can fabricate, weld, rebuild engines (2&4 stroke car, motorcycle, marine, electric [compressor, drill press, etc.]), work with electrical & plumbing, etc. Additionally I have a bit of OCD so if it is not as-good or better than stock, it isn't good enough. To compliment that, my better half is the reason why they put idiot lights on cars; and she will be using this quite frequently if I am traveling for work.

A family member recently gave us her 247.887000 snowblower. Its been sitting for almost five years in her garage and besides the dust it looks perfect. About five years ago she wanted a new snowblower and the little plastic cable thing broke (part 731-04216A) so she used that as an excuse to get something with a headlight and fancy heated grips, etc. For less than $20 its up and running (with a 4-pack of spare shear pins).

The only thing that I have done is add gas and change the oil twice, once as a flush, second time to put good, clean oil in it. It does not want to pull start. It will electric start every time but has a bouncing idle and likes to stall at lower speeds (runs at full throttle fine). My gut tells me that means the carb probably needs cleaning. (EDIT: found Tecumseh article stating surging engine at idle is OK)

Also, it had two leaky tires. I popped the beads, used bead sealer and now they are holding air however I don't know the torque number for the wheel bolts.

Questions are:
What do I need to know about these things? I don't have a problem putting in the effort to keep it maintained and in like-new condition, just don't know what I need to know.

Should I bother cleaning the carb or just change the plug and run a couple tanks of good fuel through it? Is there a proper manual somewhere (online or hard copy to purchase)? I'd like to know ALL of the torque settings as well as tolerances, etc. The Tecumseh manuals are pretty good but that's engine only. What spares should I keep around? Belts?

Wheel nut torque? Sheer pin nut torque?

Last, I have a bunch of different types of fuel available to me. What should I run in this? Would 91 octane E0 (mogas) be better than pump premium? Will 100LL get too hot?

Thanks!

TL;DR:
New to me in excellent condition 247.887000. What are wheel nut and sheer pin torques? What do I need to know about this thing to keep it in excellent shape and extremely reliable?

EDIT: I forgot to ask about the auger cable. When the handle is released the cable is fairly loose (loose enough that it could come out of the handle). Is there an adjustment inside somewhere at the belt? Could the handle be slightly bent? Cable is in new/excellent condition.

Last edited by 1215; 02-10-2016 at 10:45 PM.
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post #2 of 11 Old 02-10-2016, 11:25 PM
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I don't have the torque values but I always go snug with a 1/4 turn or so. Don't go crazy on them. Grease the auger shafts peridically so they don't rust/size onto them, check the auger shaft end "bearings" - which are really plastic cups on those I believe (A mod is to go to bearings instead) , and there are adjustments for cable tensions as the belts stretch. Some have extra holes in the handle or they have a turn buckel type adjustment on the other end. Shoot some lubricant into the cable sleeves once in awhile, hot the bearings on the pulleys, and watch the skids as the wear and adjust them to reduce wear on the scraper. Replace as needed (upgrades include using HDPE skids instead). Dont use gas with alcohol in it and try to drain it out at the end of the season. Fuels are not as stable nowadays...... they are decent machines if you treat them right. Dont have to have top of the line if your willing to put in the effort.

Manual http://www.hammerwall.com/Download_Manual/9390/




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post #3 of 11 Old 02-10-2016, 11:51 PM
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Everything bad69cat said +

Shear pins don't need to be torqued. They have either nyloc nuts, or dimpled nuts which lock them on the bolt. They should be just barely snug. You should be able to turn them with little effort by hand. They are designed to break if you get a sudden stop on the auger, and tightening them can cause the auger tube to compress and grab the inner shaft.

Take the shear bolts out and grease the zerks until it oozes out, then spin the augers free to distribute the grease internally on the inner shaft. Grease the shear bolts a bit when you put them back in, and if you have shear bolts with spacers or shoulders on them, make sure they go in the right way, so the spacer or shoulder sits in the larger hole on the auger.

Remove the wheels, and grease the axle shafts to keep them from rusting onto the wheel hubs.

Check the manual for cable adjustments and other lube points.

As far as the hard starting, could be the recoil mechanism is jammed up, or if that moves easily all the way out and all the way back, could be the valves need adjusting. There's a compression release gizzmo on the camshaft and if the valve with the gizzmo has too much clearance, it doesn't open far enough and stay open long enough during the turn over to release the compression so you can get it moving.

You can try a slightly modified method of starting with the cord.

Turn off the throttle or kill switch you have.
Pull the engine over slowly until you hit the compression stroke, then increase pressure till it gets past the TDC, then STOP.
Prime, choke, turn on full throttle / kill switch, and pull it fast and hard, so you get enough to go through the exhaust stroke easy, and hopefully enough momentum to get the intake and next compression stroke done.

Its kind of like starting a BSA Victor 441cc single cylinder motorcycle, you have to think about what your doing, or you might end up with a sore ankle.

If you can get ethenol free gas, use it. Don't go nuts with it, its not a very sophisticated engine. As far as stalling on idle, bump up the idle speed a bit, should be an adjustment screw on the throttle plate of the carb for it.
Idle should be around 1750ish RPM.

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Last edited by skutflut; 02-10-2016 at 11:54 PM.
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post #4 of 11 Old 02-11-2016, 12:21 AM
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be aware that if your machine has the plastic/composite rims you are eligible for a free set of metal rims and tires under a recall, the plastic ones can apparently blow up
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post #5 of 11 Old 02-12-2016, 11:23 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the replies. This is exactly the information I was looking for.
In general, is there any one specific way to lean the snowblower over on its side to work on it or access the underside? Should I lean it forward on the bucket/auger side vs. any one side (left or right)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bad69cat View Post
I don't have the torque values but I always go snug with a 1/4 turn or so. Don't go crazy on them. Grease the auger shafts peridically so they don't rust/size onto them, check the auger shaft end "bearings" - which are really plastic cups on those I believe (A mod is to go to bearings instead) , and there are adjustments for cable tensions as the belts stretch. Some have extra holes in the handle or they have a turn buckel type adjustment on the other end. Shoot some lubricant into the cable sleeves once in awhile, hot the bearings on the pulleys, and watch the skids as the wear and adjust them to reduce wear on the scraper. Replace as needed (upgrades include using HDPE skids instead). Dont use gas with alcohol in it and try to drain it out at the end of the season. Fuels are not as stable nowadays...... they are decent machines if you treat them right. Dont have to have top of the line if your willing to put in the effort.

Manual http://www.hammerwall.com/Download_Manual/9390/
Thanks for your reply.
How do I find out more about the auger shaft "bearing mod"? Google?
I only have one set of holes on each handle but I do see in the manual/exploded diagram that there should be a turnbuckle at the base of the cable (down near the engine). The cables are in like-new/perfect condition so I would imagine some stretch will happen/to be expected. I'll take a closer look and adjust. Thanks.
HPDE skids sounds brilliant. Is that something that is an available OEM or aftermarket part or would that be something I should plan on fabricating this summer? Is there a hardness/grade that is used (is it safe to assume that Google is my friend on this as well)?
I love E0 fuel (E0=zero ethanol)! It isn't cheap but makes everything run so much better and you can store E0 safely for up to 6 months so no worries about the end of season draining the tank/carb, etc.
Thanks for the manual link. I had the paper one but after putting a computer in the garage, electronic copies are a godsend!
Thanks again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by skutflut View Post
Everything bad69cat said +

Shear pins don't need to be torqued. They have either nyloc nuts, or dimpled nuts which lock them on the bolt. They should be just barely snug. You should be able to turn them with little effort by hand. They are designed to break if you get a sudden stop on the auger, and tightening them can cause the auger tube to compress and grab the inner shaft.

Take the shear bolts out and grease the zerks until it oozes out, then spin the augers free to distribute the grease internally on the inner shaft. Grease the shear bolts a bit when you put them back in, and if you have shear bolts with spacers or shoulders on them, make sure they go in the right way, so the spacer or shoulder sits in the larger hole on the auger.

Remove the wheels, and grease the axle shafts to keep them from rusting onto the wheel hubs.

Check the manual for cable adjustments and other lube points.

As far as the hard starting, could be the recoil mechanism is jammed up, or if that moves easily all the way out and all the way back, could be the valves need adjusting. There's a compression release gizzmo on the camshaft and if the valve with the gizzmo has too much clearance, it doesn't open far enough and stay open long enough during the turn over to release the compression so you can get it moving.

You can try a slightly modified method of starting with the cord.

Turn off the throttle or kill switch you have.
Pull the engine over slowly until you hit the compression stroke, then increase pressure till it gets past the TDC, then STOP.
Prime, choke, turn on full throttle / kill switch, and pull it fast and hard, so you get enough to go through the exhaust stroke easy, and hopefully enough momentum to get the intake and next compression stroke done.

Its kind of like starting a BSA Victor 441cc single cylinder motorcycle, you have to think about what your doing, or you might end up with a sore ankle.

If you can get ethenol free gas, use it. Don't go nuts with it, its not a very sophisticated engine. As far as stalling on idle, bump up the idle speed a bit, should be an adjustment screw on the throttle plate of the carb for it.
Idle should be around 1750ish RPM.
Shear pins: I am used to stretch bolts/fasteners in airplanes/race cars where you torque them to a very specific setting/#turns so that the shear point stretches and weakens to whatever some engineer says it should be. This seems similar to a woodruff key or an actual shear PIN vs. fastener/bolt. Sorry for any confusion but thank you for making note of that or else I would have tightened them down instead of just enough so the nylon catches and they don't come loose.
Thanks re: tips on greasing & lube. Wheel bearing grease OK? (have grease gun so should be straightforward)

By compression release gizmo do you mean the cam? The exploded diagram (PDF page 26 in the link above) doesn't look like there is anything unique/special/different in the engine. Electric start is perfectly fine and reliable. Did you mean the electric or manual recoil? I checked both and both seem fine.

Re. adjusting valves: Again, this somewhat goes back to asking about torque values. I have plenty of feeler gauges but no idea what the valve lash should be.

Any idea what specific Tecumseh model the engine is? (Craftsman 143.045003) There are plenty of full technical and service manuals from Tecumseh where I can find at least engine torque specs and settings (timing, valve lash, etc.). Just can't find a chart to translate the Craftsman part number to Tecumseh.

I had a 1964 BMW R27 that was like that and still have a few random ~250-350cc kickstart bikes. Not quite a Victor 441 but I get what you are saying. I think it could be valve lash because the starter spins faster and longer than a single pull. Almost as if the engine needs the momentum to get started. I've also noticed that it is getting a little bit better now that I've burned a tank of fuel. I had no idea how old the 1/2 tank of fuel was that it came with; I just topped it off with premium pump fuel. Now that the old fuel has burned off and its running 91 octane E0 (mogas) with a cleaner additive it is getting much better.
Thanks for the reply.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 43128 View Post
be aware that if your machine has the plastic/composite rims you are eligible for a free set of metal rims and tires under a recall, the plastic ones can apparently blow up
How do I find out more about this? Yes it does have plastic wheels. Have we missed the recall window on this? Thanks!
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post #6 of 11 Old 02-12-2016, 11:52 AM
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If you look on the engine itself - there is an ID plate with exact model and Serial. You will want that info to get the specs. Having a good Tecumseh repair manual that covers that one is a must.




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post #7 of 11 Old 02-12-2016, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1215 View Post
Any idea what specific Tecumseh model the engine is? (Craftsman 143.045003)
Looking through the Sears to Tecumseh cross reference charts, it looks like your actual engine numbers may be 143.(9)45003 and not 143.(0)45003. If this "is" your motor number, the Tecumseh model number would be a HS50-67163H for parts look up. I hope this helps.

Edit:
After further searching, it appears your 143.045003 listed in the snow blower manual is correct but does not show up in a cross reference to Tecumseh. I will say that using HSSK50 or HS50 torque values will be safe and parts interchangeability should be the same also.

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Last edited by Grunt; 02-12-2016 at 01:33 PM. Reason: correction
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post #8 of 11 Old 02-12-2016, 02:19 PM
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How do I find out more about this? Yes it does have plastic wheels. Have we missed the recall window on this? Thanks!
Call Sears.

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post #9 of 11 Old 02-12-2016, 04:39 PM
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To service the underside of the machine, tilt the unit up on the augers bucket. Make sure there is not too much gas in it or it might leak. When you put it down, leave it a while so the oil can drain back down into the crankcase. Do not tilt it on its side, you will probably get a hernia trying to wrestle it, not to mention the potential for broken finger nails, cuts, puncture wounds, colourful language etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1215 View Post

Shear pins: I am used to stretch bolts/fasteners in airplanes/race cars.

The snowblower shear bolts don reqiure torque because they are not really holding anything together, like a head bolt. They are acting kind of like a fuse instead, in that they will break their shafts from torque forces rather than linear force.

Thanks re: tips on greasing & lube. Wheel bearing grease OK? (have grease gun so should be straightforward)

Wheel bearing grease might be a bit heavy for this application. A general purpose, low temp grease works pretty well. It not a heavy load on this grease, more of a film to prevent rust and keep the two surfaces from freezing together. Thats way it a good idea to remove the bolts, grease, spin the rakes, the reinstall the bolts. Makes sure things are free running.

By compression release gizmo do you mean the cam? The exploded ....

Many small engine camshafts have a small, centrifugal device mounted NEXT to the cam closest to the cam shaft gear. At low rotation speed, this device moves the valve open a bit before the actual cam lobe does, allowing that little compression leak so you can pull the engine past the compression stroke. Once the engine catches, the device is moved out of the way of the valve by cent. force, and has no effect. https://www.partstree.com/parts/tecumseh/parts/37040/

Re. adjusting valves: Again, this somewhat goes back to asking about torque values. I have plenty of feeler gauges but no idea what the valve lash should be.

Your engine number is stamped somwhere on the engine, often on the shroud near the spark plug. You might have to remove the electric start button to find it. Once you find it, its easy to look up the valve gap specs (but not quite so easy to actually adjust valves in an L head engine).

How do I find out more about this? Yes it does have plastic wheels. Have we missed the recall window on this? Thanks!
News from CPSC I think you get a kit that you get to install. I don't think recalls ever expire.

Work fascinates me.
I can watch somebody work for hours...
2008 Craftsman 944.528391 (It's a Husqvarna ST227P)
27", B&S 305cc 13.5 ft/lb Torque 9.5 hp

Last edited by skutflut; 02-12-2016 at 07:17 PM.
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post #10 of 11 Old 02-12-2016, 09:08 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you so much for all of the replies! I'm sure I'll have more questions shortly and I will followup/reply ASAP.

Engine model sticker says 143.055001. Engine Family 4TPXS.1951BF (195cc)

For the wheel bolt torque I went with the standard SAE J429 Grade 5 tightening torque which states that (with use of a thread locker) I should be tightening to ~178 in/lb which is about 14.8 ft/lb. I happen to have an in/lb torque wrench so 178in/lb it was.
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