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You won't see turbos on small snow blowers unless they are
three cylinder air cooled diesels with indirect or direct injection
as the turbocharger is mounted on the exhaust manifold as a rule
to allow easier placement of the intake and pressure piping for the
air inlet.
Maybe a two-stroke diesel...
 

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I guess it's possible if comparing a lean running (EPA compliant) carb to a lean running EFI setup the EFI would perform better.

But a properly tuned carb to a crude EFI setup like on these small engines I personally see no reason to expect a power increase at all let alone a big one.

I have no doubt any machines made over the last few years would be running on the lean side though.
 

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There are many many members here that have turned up engine speed on carbed models and swear by the performance increase as night and day...that will have them throttle wide open at 3600 with full load.
I don't Personally..I actually run at 3450 for engine life

you mean me lol
the performance increase comes from a higher impeller rpm
if the jets are lean at 3600 requiring choke they are dead at 3900 again ive done it
meanwhile you are running 3400
at 4500 theres hole in the block
[email protected] specs
they are not at full throttle @3600
Most people are actually lean on the pilot circuit not the main..a large portion of the fuel comes from the pilot circuit under no load condition as the throttle is barely open...this causes the surging more often than the main.
Also the higher the rpm the stiffer the spring needs to be..the weights in the governor have four times as much force when speed is doubled..so to achieve the same percentage of droop lighter spring for slower rpm..stronger spring for higher rpm...yes you can adjust the rpm up with the lighter spring but droop will be less than with the stiffer spring.
That is why alot of the engines start to surge at higher rpm when over sped...the pilot isn't feeding any more fuel at 3600 vs 3900..as its reliance is more on vacuum than venturi effect...second ..too light a spring.
No...I dont run 4500 and pull down tp 3450..my no load speed is 3450 before pull down...The mention of 4000 plus rpms is what the the AF remains consistent to as compared to 3600 under full load.
And agreed the butterfly is not fully open at 3600 rpm if the engine is governed for 3600 on a carb engine...its what I have been saying for the last several posts.


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To be fair I assume we're all trying to compare apples to apples IE stock machines to stock machines.

Rejetting the carb and modifying the governor and then comparing to a totally stock EFI machine isn't really fair.

What I do find fascinating is that I saw many on here bashing EFI saying they would never own it and no one should buy it and I don't recall anyone defending it and now I've seen what, two threads this week with multiple people saying how great it is.
 

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Maybe a two-stroke diesel...
========================================================================================

The one that was brought out in 2014 was water cooled with a turbocharger
and heavier than a 4 stroke air cooled Duetz or HATZ diesel engine.
 

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To be fair I assume we're all trying to compare apples to apples IE stock machines to stock machines.

Rejetting the carb and modifying the governor and then comparing to a totally stock EFI machine isn't really fair.

What I do find fascinating is that I saw many on here bashing EFI saying they would never own it and no one should buy it and I don't recall anyone defending it and now I've seen what, two threads this week with multiple people saying how great it is.
Well many on here do bump engine speed to 3800 to 3900 ..which offsets the droop..could actually have an advantage under lighter load as rpms will be higher than with the non adjustable EFI units.
When pulled down under load the machines would be equal.
In all reality max horsepower is only about a fourth of a horsepower higher with the EFI unit shown anyway.
The advantage with the EFI is less governor droop which let's engine rpm stay up during lighter load conditions.
I am not bashing EFI ..just showing that it has a very low droop rate.
I am still a carb man..I like to choose my RPM as I have a rock driveway..carb cleaning is essentially free...thus cheaper to maintain...if a carb clogs..I can fix it in short order. If the EFI has issues I would be down a while.
Sure the EFI is nice...it starts right up..no choke to have to mess with...virtually no governor droop which will keep RPM up better under partial loads .
I won't be buying one as long as carbed units are still being sold


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EFI would be better under most conditions, as it can adjust for ambient temperature, elevation, etc.

While a carb can be set up to run ideal, carbs rarely run ideal. I own a dirt bike, and it's absolutely frustrating for me to attempt to find the correct jet sizes, clip position, etc, to run ideally at different elevations and ambient temps. In fact, I'm thinking of trading it in for an EFI bike simply because I'm tired of fiddling with the carb to get the best performance.
 

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EFI would be better under most conditions, as it can adjust for ambient temperature, elevation, etc.

While a carb can be set up to run ideal, carbs rarely run ideal. I own a dirt bike, and it's absolutely frustrating for me to attempt to find the correct jet sizes, clip position, etc, to run ideally at different elevations and ambient temps. In fact, I'm thinking of trading it in for an EFI bike simply because I'm tired of fiddling with the carb to get the best performance.
Completely off topic but there were carburetors that would adjust mixture vs altitude and barometric pressure. I owned one and honestly I had no complaints about it.

Besides a barometric pressure sensor it also used an O2 sensor.

Just throwing it out there.
 

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Completely off topic but there were carburetors that would adjust mixture vs altitude and barometric pressure. I owned one and honestly I had no complaints about it.

Besides a barometric pressure sensor it also used an O2 sensor.

Just throwing it out there.
Yup. Thought about buying a Lectron carb, but it still wouldn't provide the precise levels of metering that EFI can provide.

And I do believe this is on topic, as it shows that while carbs do work, it is very rarely that they work as ideally as an EFI system can work with regards to metering.
 

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Completely off topic but there were carburetors that would adjust mixture vs altitude and barometric pressure. I owned one and honestly I had no complaints about it.

Besides a barometric pressure sensor it also used an O2 sensor.

Just throwing it out there.
The reality is both systems have their positives and negatives.

I’m a motorcycle guy at heart, and I love CV carbs for anything not racing. Except compared to EFI. With that said, I certainly wouldn’t want a CV on A snow blower. It’s far too complex for what these machines require. Just imagine all the “ran last year but won’t start this season” complaints if these things had CV carbs.

(CV carbs self adjust for atmospheric pressure and offer near EFI quality throttle response, economy, etc, but they are fairly complex)

Overall my 2 cents is personally I still prefer carbs on snow blowers but I’m not blind to the benefits of EFI. I’ll switch “allegiances” if they ditch the battery and go to a “two pull” setup like most snowmobiles with EFI.
 

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Point is Honda use EFI on high end right?
Pretty much every automobile engine these days is EFI. This trickles down to many multi-cylinder engines. My point is that Honda has further trickled it down to the higher end inverter generators in the "small engine" (read under 500cc) space, but not yet into the snowblower market. Personally I'm looking forward to the technology advance (cleaner running), but the existing carbureted GX390 works just fine for me...
 

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Just a question… we know carbs are sensitive to improper fuel system maintenance between seasons. I also know fuel injector ports are much smaller than any ports in a carb. I would think EFI would be even more susceptible to first start of season fuel issues than a carb when fuel systems are not properly “summarized”. What am I missing? We already know EFI can be battery challenged at the start of a new season if the battery is not properly maintained.
 

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Just a question… we know carbs are sensitive to improper fuel system maintenance between seasons. I also know fuel injector ports are much smaller than any ports in a carb. I would think EFI would be even more susceptible to first start of season fuel issues than a carb when fuel systems are not properly “summarized”. What am I missing? We already know EFI can be battery challenged at the start of a new season if the battery is not properly maintained.
I'm by no means an expert, but the EFI system on these engines is a very simple throttle body style system. The claim is that because the system is sealed (unlike a carb, which has to be vented to the atmosphere to work), there's less chance of the fuel going bad in the first place.

My Deluxe 30 EFI will start easily after sitting for months and months, but as you've mentioned the battery does need to be charged. I also stabilize my fuel, and don't run gasoline that contains ethanol.

The technology itself is proven I would think, since pretty much all cars were running throttle body injection back in the 1980's already.

That said, time will tell as to the long term reliability of the system. But the EFI system on these blowers is about as simple as they can get really... There's nothing complex about it, and anyone that's comfortable stripping apart a carb wouldn't find this simple EFI system overwhelming in how it works.
 

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EFI is proven on cars, not on snow blowers.

EFI with computer management systems are going to give you a performance edge for sure, but is this worth it on snow blower?

There are cost and benefit that everyone (include Honda) has to weight. I would still pick a bigger cc engine over an EFI engine right now.

Same with the electronic chute control. Everyone want them biggest and baldest. Not until they break.
 

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EFI is proven on cars, not on snow blowers.

EFI with computer management systems are going to give you a performance edge for sure, but is this worth it on snow blower?

There are cost and benefit that everyone (include Honda) has to weight. I would still pick a bigger cc engine over an EFI engine right now.

Same with the electronic chute control. Everyone want them biggest and baldest. Not until they break.
I understand your choice but me having a manual chute on my Rapidtrak PRO with EFI, next year the Rapidtrak PRO gets a electric chute but the EFI are taken away. Thought I wanted the 2022 model but without EFI I am really not so sure anymore.
 

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How many injectors are in a snowblower? I was reading about failed car injectors and there was a comment to the effect, “don’t worry, there are multiple injectors, so even if one fails, the others will start the vehicle.”
 

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How many injectors are in a snowblower? I was reading about failed car injectors and there was a comment to the effect, “don’t worry, there are multiple injectors, so even if one fails, the others will start the vehicle.”
There are no injectors on an EFI snow engine as you may think them to be...
 

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I have been looking up injector stories from motorcycles and will say there are limited stories about problems of old gas and EFI engines. But I did read an anecdote why shutting off fuel to the carb is important that I’m not sure I’ve heard before:

It's also especially problematic on engines with gravity-fed carburetors because if you don't shut off the fuel supply, the float valve will continually replace the gas that evaporates out of the bowl, creating an increasingly thick layer of the crap that's left behind when gasoline evaporates. If you shut the petcock, only the gas in the bowl evaporates which may or may not leave enough gunk to cause problems. (Lawnmowers and such are gravity fed but usually don't have fuel shutoffs, which is part of why they're often thought to be more ethanol sensitive.)
 

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I have been looking up injector stories from motorcycles and will say there are limited stories about problems of old gas and EFI engines. But I did read an anecdote why shutting off fuel to the carb is important that I’m not sure I’ve heard before:

It's also especially problematic on engines with gravity-fed carburetors because if you don't shut off the fuel supply, the float valve will continually replace the gas that evaporates out of the bowl, creating an increasingly thick layer of the crap that's left behind when gasoline evaporates. If you shut the petcock, only the gas in the bowl evaporates which may or may not leave enough gunk to cause problems. (Lawnmowers and such are gravity fed but usually don't have fuel shutoffs, which is part of why they're often thought to be more ethanol sensitive.)
This right here. Your “quote” is spot on, and explains probably 95% of carb issues in power equipment (and motorcycles too). I’ve mentioned this in other posts around here.

On an EFI system, there is even less fuel to worry about evaporating, and it’s less likely to evaporate at all. Plus it’s pump fed, so even if a little varnish is in the injector orifice, it’s got a good chance to be dislodged by the higher pressure the pump provided.
 
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