[ChrisJ]

Hi all

I'm sorry it's been a while since I've posted.
The 924108 (late 90s 24" )has been pretty solid. I just added 20 pounds to the front which helped a lot.

But...I still have a severe dislike for the HMSK.
Its carburetor design aside, I often find my self wanting more power. Perhaps it's weak due to age, but the fact it doesn't seem to use oil I suspect it's running as strong as it always did.

Anyway that's all besides the point. Has anyone converted one of these Ariens or similar to a Honda or clone? If so what modifications were necessary? The biggest one I see needing is the pivot for the chute that currently bolts to the top of the Tecumseh.

Also, what about carburetor heat etc?

I'm eyeing up the 8HP Predator but I'll be honest, that 13 HP isn't out of the question if it'll fit. I deal with a lot of heavy snow and slush and often find my self stopping the wheels or going slow just to keep the impeller speed higher because I need the distance. As far as I know, it's running good ever since I did the valves and it idles fine and doesn't hesitate.

I'm planning on keeping the machine going as it seems like the Snow King aside it's built better than most of the cheaper machines these days.

 

[3repete]

Hi all

I'm sorry it's been a while since I've posted.
The 924108 (late 90s 24" )has been pretty solid. I just added 20 pounds to the front which helped a lot.

But...I still have a severe dislike for the HMSK.
Its carburetor design aside, I often find my self wanting more power. Perhaps it's weak due to age, but the fact it doesn't seem to use oil I suspect it's running as strong as it always did.

Anyway that's all besides the point. Has anyone converted one of these Ariens or similar to a Honda or clone? If so what modifications were necessary? The biggest one I see needing is the pivot for the chute that currently bolts to the top of the Tecumseh.

Also, what about carburetor heat etc?

I'm eyeing up the 8HP Predator but I'll be honest, that 13 HP isn't out of the question if it'll fit. I deal with a lot of heavy snow and slush and often find my self stopping the wheels or going slow just to keep the impeller speed higher because I need the distance. As far as I know, it's running good ever since I did the valves and it idles fine and doesn't hesitate.

I'm planning on keeping the machine going as it seems like the Snow King aside it's built better than most of the cheaper machines these days.

Do It!
I sold my 2005 824 and got an earlier commercial 11528LE (DLE?) which turned out to be awesome. It's only drawback is it is the model before they started doing the quick turn differentials.
If you keep your old machine get at least 10 HP. It doesn't have to be a Predator. If you search on Ebay for horizontal 12 horse 11 horse etc you will fine major brands too. You don't have to buy a harbor Freight engine.
Find out what inside diameter the main pulley (sheave) is and buy based on that... So you can just install the pulley right on the bigger engine.
Or go get a bigger machine.
If you get one that doesn't run well they can need carburetor work. You can fix that or just buy a whole carb pretty reasonably.
Mine has a quick turn chute which is it's best operating feature. It has a remote for the height angle on the chute too. It has heated grips, headlight, tall bucket, larger impeller and the bigger gear case. Because of the larger impeller it throws the snow way farther than my last machine. Lotta fun to shoot plumes!

 

[140278]

moving this to the repowering section

 

[arienskids]

I saw this on eBay the other day, if you don’t mind using a shaft adapter it’s a great deal

11HP LCT Horizontal Snow Engine 369CC 3/4" Shaft 585742702 | eBay

MODEL NUMBER: LCT PW2HK181000 / Husqvarna 585742702. POWER OUTPUT: 11HP. SHAFT SIZE: (D x L) 3/4" X 2-7/16" to mounting face. (2-5/32" to crankshaft shoulder), Keyed 3/16". SHAFT MOUNTING: Horizontal Shaft.

www.ebay.com

 

[ChrisJ]

Do It!
I sold my 2005 824 and got an earlier commercial 11528LE (DLE?) which turned out to be awesome. It's only drawback is it is the model before they started doing the quick turn differentials.
If you keep your old machine get at least 10 HP. It doesn't have to be a Predator. If you search on Ebay for horizontal 12 horse 11 horse etc you will fine major brands too. You don't have to buy a harbor Freight engine.
Find out what inside diameter the main pulley (sheave) is and buy based on that... So you can just install the pulley right on the bigger engine.
Or go get a bigger machine.
If you get one that doesn't run well they can need carburetor work. You can fix that or just buy a whole carb pretty reasonably.
Mine has a quick turn chute which is it's best operating feature. It has a remote for the height angle on the chute too. It has heated grips, headlight, tall bucket, larger impeller and the bigger gear case. Because of the larger impeller it throws the snow way farther than my last machine. Lotta fun to shoot plumes!

One of the big issues I've got is I store it in a heated crawl space and I can't fit a 28 thru the door.

But on that note, my dad has an early 90s White with a 10 horse HMSK engine on it but I was avoiding using it just because it seems like they kind of suck in general. The Honda clones just always seem much more responsive and aggressive.

Of course that could just be my imagination.
I have 3 carbs for my 8hp because I kept fighting etc it. Right now its got an older style "new" as of a few years ago oem carb with adjustable main and idle jets. I also set the rpm using a tach.


Maybe the 10 horse snow king is worth a try as it's free?

 

[3vanman]

Anything "free" is definitely worth a try.
As for carbs, I see as many or more "Honda clones" with carb issues as I do Tecumsehs. Issue most complained about the clones is there is no replaceable needle and seat when rebuilding, just a needle, thus frequently some are replacing the carb with an after market knock off..thus knock off carb on a knock off engine....

 

[3repete]

I didn't really answer your question before. Sorry.

I am a bit of a carburetor nerd, so I understand they are not always that easy to deal with. But once you have worked on a few you begin to understand them. They start to make sense.

A 10 horse on a small frame machine should do super well. I'd suggest running it on the bench first. BTW I think my 11.5 OHSK may be a relative of your HMSK and it is great. I have it a little overclocked, it turns around 3600 rpm wide open. Snow really flies far and nothing bogs it down.

On another front. Slush takes power and impeller speed. Thankfully rpms create more power. If you want to get the rpms up on the existing engine you can likely go a couple hundred more RPM before the governor causes much resistance. I was able to do it by using a different hole in the throttle linkage to cause the throttle spring to pull a little harder on the throttle pivot. The spring is tiny and delicate, I used jewelry sized pliers and a small hook to move it.
btw, I have accidentally bent the hook end of a spring before, thankfully they can be bent back and reshaped.

And the carb kits come with too many parts, so if you get one don't worry that there are extra pieces.

I think a slush situation would benefit from the impeller mod too.

Good luck, keep us updated!

 

[tpenfield]

I saw this on eBay the other day, if you don’t mind using a shaft adapter it’s a great deal

11HP LCT Horizontal Snow Engine 369CC 3/4" Shaft 585742702 | eBay

MODEL NUMBER: LCT PW2HK181000 / Husqvarna 585742702. POWER OUTPUT: 11HP. SHAFT SIZE: (D x L) 3/4" X 2-7/16" to mounting face. (2-5/32" to crankshaft shoulder), Keyed 3/16". SHAFT MOUNTING: Horizontal Shaft.

www.ebay.com

I too have seen that engine . . . BUT . . . it seems to have the European / Asian plug . . . not sure if it would require a retrofit on the starter for USA. Might still be worth it though

 

[ChrisJ]

I didn't really answer your question before. Sorry.

I am a bit of a carburetor nerd, so I understand they are not always that easy to deal with. But once you have worked on a few you begin to understand them. They start to make sense.

A 10 horse on a small frame machine should do super well. I'd suggest running it on the bench first. BTW I think my 11.5 OHSK may be a relative of your HMSK and it is great. I have it a little overclocked, it turns around 3600 rpm wide open. Snow really flies far and nothing bogs it down.

On another front. Slush takes power and impeller speed. Thankfully rpms create more power. If you want to get the rpms up on the existing engine you can likely go a couple hundred more RPM before the governor causes much resistance. I was able to do it by using a different hole in the throttle linkage to cause the throttle spring to pull a little harder on the throttle pivot. The spring is tiny and delicate, I used jewelry sized pliers and a small hook to move it.
btw, I have accidentally bent the hook end of a spring before, thankfully they can be bent back and reshaped.

And the carb kits come with too many parts, so if you get one don't worry that there are extra pieces.

I think a slush situation would benefit from the impeller mod too.

Good luck, keep us updated!

I set it to 3600 using a tach. I do want more but I've seen bad things about the HMSK throwing rods etc so I've been hesitant.

The next thing I can't figure out is it runs good, it idles good but it stinks. I'm talking burning eyes.

If I lean it out any it starts to hesitate and miss occasionally so I'm kind of lost at this point. I've done many carbs, even Quadrajets but I'm at a loss here. I've wondered if my idle jet is actually a hair lean causing me to run the main jet a little too rich.


Or maybe this is just as good as it gets?

It smells way too rich but doesn't behave like it. I don't get it.

 

[ChrisJ]

Hi all,


I need opinions..
My issue is I'm more often than not dealing with wet packed snow at the end of the driveway and I can't throw it far, or high enough. I figure, some of this is because I need to do an impeller mod and some of it is because of the engine slowing down under load. 90% of my battle is wet packed snow at the end of driveways because our road gets salted and plowed constantly. It does the sidewalks fine as is but that packed wet snow.........oh boy. Sometimes, I could get by with 25% further.... but often my life would be a whole lot better if it could throw the heavy snow twice as far. Of course that might not be realistic.

If I swap the HMSK100 on there it should gain me some, but will it likely be enough and if so, would I want to increase the sheath size as well to get my impeller speed higher? Or, would the HMSK100 just not be enough of an increase over the HMSK80 to justify that since I'm dealing with heavy snow all of the time?

Right now.......I'm thinking impeller mod regardless, but that aside HMSK100 + stock pulley sizes with hopes to keep RPM higher or 13HP Predator + 3.5" sheath (Stock size is 2.75 mating a 9" pulley).

Thoughts?

 

[ChrisJ]

I don't know....

I can get my hands on a 4A032 III engine for a very very good price.
It's a small 4 cylinder military engine rated 6HP @ 3600 rpm at 10,000 feet altitude. Apparently real world it's more like 10-12HP.
They're beautiful little aluminum air cooled engines, but it seems way too long for the little Ariens.

Here's an example of one running.

It even has a heated air setup and all.

 

[ChrisJ]

Well, this sucks.

I was really going towards stealing the HM100 from a 1997 White / MTD blower my dad has and then a good friend wanted the White without the engine.
I just noticed, it looks like it's a 2 shaft Tecumseh on the White.

I can't do that, the blower is in good shape and that would be a problem adapting a new engine to it.

 

[cpchriste]

I just noticed, it looks like it's a 2 shaft Tecumseh on the White.
I can't do that, the blower is in good shape and that would be a problem adapting a new engine to it.

Just remove the camshaft pulley and use as is? What am I missing?

 

[ChrisJ]

Just remove the camshaft pulley and use as is? What am I missing?

I don't want to pull a good engine off of a good snowblower that needs a 2 shaft engine.

 

[ChrisJ]

So,
Here's another reason the 2 shaft Tecumseh engines won't work well on a machine setup for a single shaft engine.

The 2 shaft engine has what appears to be an extension on the main shaft to get the pulleys out further so they clear the cam PTO shaft for the drive belt.
So trying to use it on a machine setup for a single shaft Tecumseh means you would need to shift the engine back about 2 inches +-. That's going by eye, I didn't actually measure.

Regardless, I'm sure it's possible but it's a lot more work than it's worth in my opinion.

 

[JLawrence08648]

So,
Here's another reason the 2 shaft Tecumseh engines won't work well on a machine setup for a single shaft engine.

The 2 shaft engine has what appears to be an extension on the main shaft to get the pulleys out further so they clear the cam PTO shaft for the drive belt.
So trying to use it on a machine setup for a single shaft Tecumseh means you would need to shift the engine back about 2 inches +-. That's going by eye, I didn't actually measure.

Regardless, I'm sure it's possible but it's a lot more work than it's worth in my opinion.

Why can't you move the pulleys closer to the engine? Or are we dealing with a keyway that doesn't extend that deep?

 

[ChrisJ]

Why can't you move the pulleys closer to the engine? Or are we dealing with a keyway that doesn't extend that deep?

The shaft for the first 1.5 to 2" or so is much larger in diameter and has no keyway.
I didn't measure that either, but it looked to be 1.25" or larger in diameter. The smaller end appeared to measure 1".

 

[ChrisJ]

@tpenfield @Shovel @Julien Morrissette
Looking for opinions.

I bought a Predator 420 and am basically setting up shop to do the conversion. The specific one I ended up with is a hemi with an alleged 19.8 ftlb @ 2500.
Right now, the plan is to convert my 24" 924 machine over to a double 4L belt setup for the impeller, though I am planning on AX belts for now.

Pulley sizes...... there's plenty of opinions. But I'm not sure what direction I want to go in.
Best I can tell my dad's Ariens Hydro Pro 32 uses a 2.75" and an 8.5". That has a B&S 420cc and a 14" impeller.

I have the Ariens 8.5" OD double pulley, the Ariens double idler and a few options for the engine I think I can make work.

3.45" OD
3.25" OD
3.05" OD

I have both 42" and 43" belts and I think between those sizes and adjusting the idler position things should work well.

Since my machine mainly deals with wet packed snow and slush I'm thinking the 3.05" is the way to go, but I'm not sure. Honestly, I'm concerned it may be too much of an increase.

I need it to throw the wet packed heavy snow and slush as far as possible, 15-20 feet would really make me happy. I don't care about dry powder at all really, that'll take care of it self.

The 8.5" + 3.05 gives me just under 1300 RPM, 1290 I think in theory with my 12" impeller. Is this asking too much of the 420cc engine?
What about 3 blade vs 4 blade vs 6 blade impellers? Which does best with wet packed snow?

I'm doing an impeller kit and all new bearings.

 

[Shovel]

@tpenfield @Shovel @Julien Morrissette
Looking for opinions.

I bought a Predator 420 and am basically setting up shop to do the conversion. The specific one I ended up with is a hemi with an alleged 19.8 ftlb @ 2500.
Right now, the plan is to convert my 24" 924 machine over to a double 4L belt setup for the impeller, though I am planning on AX belts for now.

Pulley sizes...... there's plenty of opinions. But I'm not sure what direction I want to go in.
Best I can tell my dad's Ariens Hydro Pro 32 uses a 2.75" and an 8.5". That has a B&S 420cc and a 14" impeller.

I have the Ariens 8.5" OD double pulley, the Ariens double idler and a few options for the engine I think I can make work.

3.45" OD
3.25" OD
3.05" OD

I have both 42" and 43" belts and I think between those sizes and adjusting the idler position things should work well.

Since my machine mainly deals with wet packed snow and slush I'm thinking the 3.05" is the way to go, but I'm not sure. Honestly, I'm concerned it may be too much of an increase.

I need it to throw the wet packed heavy snow and slush as far as possible, 15-20 feet would really make me happy. I don't care about dry powder at all really, that'll take care of it self.

The 8.5" + 3.05 gives me just under 1300 RPM, 1290 I think in theory with my 12" impeller. Is this asking too much of the 420cc engine?
What about 3 blade vs 4 blade vs 6 blade impellers? Which does best with wet packed snow?

I'm doing an impeller kit and all new bearings.

The predator engine power ratings are conservative on the smaller predator...so I can assume assume the larger predator engine will deliver the oats it claims.
A 12 inch impeller at 1300 rpm is approaching honda territory....an impeller rpm of 1300 to 1400 rpm should be fine with that large engine.
1400 rpm will have you inline with impeller tip speed of the large hondas..I would consider that my absolute max for my build.
It may not toss like a Honda when finished..due to chute design..but should throw snow like a champ

Sent from my SM-A115U1 using Tapatalk

 

[ChrisJ]

The predator engine power ratings are conservative on the smaller predator...so I can assume assume the larger predator engine will deliver the oats it claims.
A 12 inch impeller at 1300 rpm is approaching honda territory....an impeller rpm of 1300 to 1400 rpm should be fine with that large engine.
1400 rpm will have you inline with impeller tip speed of the large hondas..I would consider that my absolute max for my build.
It may not toss like a Honda when finished..due to chute design..but should throw snow like a champ

Sent from my SM-A115U1 using Tapatalk

Thank you for responding!

If it was you, would you go for the 3.05 or the 3.25 mated with the 8.5" lower pulley? How do the Hondas handle really wet snow? The kind of snow it feels like you're going to break the shovel handle lifting.