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Discussion Starter #1
I apparently started changing the oil in my old toro 828 powershift 8 hp B&S and neglected to finish the job by adding oil - then we got snow on Saturday into Sunday and I ran it without oil - seized up in about 3 minutes - not sure how much damage occurred but I'm hoping this site will help me out with either repairs or repowering
located in RI
thanks
 

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You could try breaking the crank loose by rocking a pipe wrench back and forth. My guess is the engine has some internal damage and will let go sooner or later. If you wanted to be more through you could take it apart and inspect all the pieces. Some oil or even better ATF down the spark plug hole might soak down through the piston and lubricate that. I think I have heard of people using diesel, PB blaster and any type of penetrating oil as well.

Harbor Freight sells some nice engines cheap. You can check the Repower section of the forum for a lot of engine swaps. Most people use the 212cc which is around 6.5-7 HP, you might want to jump up to at least the 301cc with is around 8 HP.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
plan right now is to pull off the head and see if there is any obvious damage on that end, then go "deeper" - I did get the crank to move a little but given the snow and no reason to spend more time on it in the driveway, in the shop until time's available

thanks for the help
 

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:welcome: to the forum firedudetl1


So sorry to hear about it :facepalm_zpsdj194qh
Let us know what the walls look like when you get a chance to tear it down.
Photo or two would be good.
What is it's model and serial number ??
 

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The Predator 301cc 8hp will bolt right in and you will see a performance improvement with it as well over the old flat head Briggs & Stratton
 

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More often than not the rod will seize onto the crank first - I think that one may have an actual rod bearing though? Might be salvageable but I would pull it all and go deep first then decide......
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I don't have the model or serial number as the plate is missing - didn't notice that when I bought it - will try pictures when I get into it - -may try just the bearing if there is one....

when can I get the Predator engine and any ideas on the cost?

thanks to all for the comments - feeling a little better about not having to junk the whole machine - too nice a design
 

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put a big breaker bar on the crank bolt and break it free. see if it will run like that add some oil to it and some 2 stroke to the gas(always do this after an engine seize, it helps to lubricate the cylinder wall where most of the damage occured). if it wont run or runs for a bit and chucks the rod at least you can say you tried and you can throw a predator on it
 

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Firedude, welcome aboard!

The Predator replacements are found at Harbor Freight (Attleboro, Warwick, etc.) and are likely to be the most economical way to get up 'n' running again. Look at the cost, I doubt there's any way a repair from your local shop could compete. Good luck!
 

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I don't have the model or serial number as the plate is missing - didn't notice that when I bought it - will try pictures when I get into it - -may try just the bearing if there is one....

when can I get the Predator engine and any ideas on the cost?
I cannot imagine that the old engine will be much good, even if you break it loose. Maybe just a side project for a tear-down and re-build.

You have 3 Harbor Freights in/near RI, so you might want to verify if they have the Predator 301cc in stock before you head out.

$239.99 + tax for the 301cc (8 hp) not sure if there are any active coupons.

On your current 8 hp B&S, you may want to verify the crankshaft diameter where the pully attaches. I believe the 301cc is a 1" dia shaft. The 212cc is a 3/4" shaft.

I replaced the engine on my Toro 521 last year with the 212cc. Pretty easy job.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I have 2 Ariens ( 7 hp not sure what width, and an 8 hp 32 inch) to handle any new snow, so I'm thinking the toro may have to wait a bit, I do want to open it up and see how badly damaged, but it looking like re-powering is the way to go - I'll stop at the local H-F to check availability
of course, I'll get the repowering done and we won't get any more snow...
 

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I think the HF 301 motor has the same size shaft as the motor on the toro. while it cost more than the HF212 motor I would still go with the 301 or another 8hp motor
 

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If you're going to re-power, don't mess with the old engine. Someone might want it before the rod punches a hole out the side.
 

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Because this is going to be a summer project you can also get a cheap, new, Tecumseh generator engine and go with an 11hp if you like the Tim Taylor school of thought (more power).

There are some threads on others who have made the conversion. The main hurdle is the tapered shaft.

They can be found around a 100 even. Small Engine Surplus.com OH318EA-222712 Tecumseh 11 HP
 

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dump some ATF down the cylinder and free it up with a bar. Start it and see what happens. If it's no knocking keep running it. It will probably start consuming oil but more often than not they'll survive being run without oil.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
thanks for the atf advise - will have to try that (marvel mystery oil as alternative?) - definately a summer project at this point - found an old 8 hp/24 inch ariens on craigslist for $275 - got it for $240, so I now have my "insurance" snowblower for the rest of this season - going to do an oil change (including adding the oil.... duh...) - add a fuel filter and maybe new belts - will probably be looking for chains as this has "turf tires" but for right now, I'm good for the next storm (which could be next season and that would be fine)
 
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