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Upgrading your snowblower lights to LED lights (Please see 1st post edit/mouseover this link)

1.1M views 1.6K replies 274 participants last post by  FarmerBob  
#1 ·
[Edit: LED technology has improved exponentially since this thread was started. Be aware that earlier posts may be somewhat outdated, and that you will likely find the most useful information in later updates. Y.R.]

In this thread, we'll talk about the do's and don'ts of LED headlight upgrades for your snowblower, and post videos and pictures of our successes.
There are many models of snowblowers that have a headlight circuit, In most cases, you can find a single wire that registers at anywhere from 12v to 20v AC (with no load) that is located somewhere on the engine, many times under the gas tank. Halogen lights are the typical light that comes with many of our snowblowers. Many of us want much more light than what the halogen bulb can give us, as well as better reliability than a halogen bulb. The search for something brighter and more reliable ends with the LED light. LED's (Light Emitting Diodes) are extremely efficient, very bright, and have thousands of hours of reliable use.
Since the lighting circuit is typically AC current at somewhere between 40-60hertz, if you just attach an LED light to the circuit you'll get pulsing light (think on and off 40-60 times a second) This is caused by the nature of an LED, because an LED is polarity sensitive, and has no warm-up or cool down time when compared to a halogen bulb filament, the LED will flicker noticeably. The flickering of an LED on AC current is mildly annoying to many people, but VERY annoying when you are attaching it to a moving object like a snowblower. An LED that is in motion when attached to AC current (for reasons I won't even begin to get into) flickers much more noticeably. To test this for yourself, take a strand of LED Christmas lights, plug them in, and then swing them in front of you at arm's length, you'll see a strobing or flickering effect.
You can see many LED headlight upgrade videos on youtube like this one, where you can definitely see the flickering or strobing of the LED's. You can see the effect the flicker has on the video camera, you get weird tracks that go from top to bottom of the video frame.
1. EXAMPLE OF IMPROPER LED LIGHT INSTALL- NOTICE THE FLICKERING
2. EXAMPLE OF YET AGAIN AN IMPROPER LED LIGHT INSTALL- NOTICE THE FLICKERING
This is what it looks like once you add a bridge rectifier, even though you’ll see a tiny bit of flicker in the video, in person there is none, you also can notice that there is no “tracking” effect like in the other videos.

The problem of light flicker is solved by using a full wave bridge rectifier.

A bridge rectifier takes AC current and changes it into DC current using 4 diodes.

By connecting the positive and negative from your LED light(s) to the DC output of your bridge rectifier, and then connecting your single headlight circuit wire to one of the AC inputs of the bridge rectifier (it doesn't matter which AC input) and then attaching a wire from the metal of your snowblower to the other AC input you will have light! For safety purposes, it is recommended that you place a fuse on the headlight circuit wire before the bridge rectifier which should be about 5 amps rated fast blow, and then a fuse on the positive wiring between your bridge rectifier and your LED light that should be about ~1amp fast blow fuses. These fuse ratings are assuming you are using a headlight circuit that is rated for ~1amp at about 18volts, some headlight circuits are rated for 2, 3, or more amps, so using an amperage calculator like this one can help with both your LED light selection and your fuse selection. Volts/Amps/Watts Converter
Here's a pic of how I installed my bridge rectifier, I mounted it right next to my keyed switch that is on my handlebar console. I also used heat sink paste to couple the bridge rectifier’s metal casing to the console’s metal. I know this is way overkill, but my bridge rectifier came with the paste, and it was an easy application of some paste. The bridge rectifier I used is rated at 50amps 100volts KBPC5010 Bridge Rectifier | Alltronics

UPDATE: Using two 2200mfd 50v capacitors may be needed to clean up the voltage ripple that comes off of the DC output on your bridge rectifier. Some LED lights are sensitive to this ripple and may fail prematurely. Simply adding these capacitors in parallel on the DC output side of the bridge rectifier is a good precaution. Wire in the Capacitor(s) between the LED light(s) and the bridge rectifier. So the positive and negative of the bridge rectifier will go to the positive and negative of the capacitor. Then the positive and negative of the capacitor then get wired to the LED(s) positive and negative.

When choosing your LED lighting you typically have spotlights or flood lights available. Spotlights have a more pinpoint dispersion with very little side spill of light. Flood lights illuminate a wider area, and with the short distances (from LED light to relevant distance in front of your snowblower) you’ll want as wide dispersion as possible, or else you’ll get a tiny area in front of you illuminated. I made sure to get floodlights that were rated for voltage below what my snowblower headlight circuit tests at and above, so being that my snowblower headlight circuit tests at 18volts I picked a set of LED floodlights that were rated for 9-32 volts. I wanted to make sure that I would never be putting the floodlights in danger with whatever voltage the headlight circuit was producing, even a small voltage peak is accounted for. The floodlights I chose are 9 watts each, which is as much as my headlight circuit is rated for.
For those that appreciate a short(ish) video with some basic points noted here is a video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZwebMaiyBY
 
#1,548 · (Edited)
So the 10.6VAC sounds about right @ stator's output, might be a touch low esp if you unplugged it as Ariens says my 60W EFI's stator shuold be 11.5VAC - 14VAC @ WOT.........You MIGHT have a stator winding loop or two shorted, not sure......What type meter are you using? A lower end meter might give an error of 1V or 2V, depends esp on a raw noisy ole stator measurement.

HOWEVER, after the rectifier and caps(it cleaner for measuring) it becomes around *(10.6VAC*1.414 = 15VDC) unloaded, including diode drops(15V -0.6*2 = 13.8VDC).........Loaded(lights on) measuring 10VDC sounds about right, the lights are probably 40W, 50W, 60W?


*10.6VAC is a "RMS" voltage reading we get from our meters on the standard AC setting, which when rectified and filter it becomes mostly a "peak" value and then more or less stays(when unloaded and filtered) around this peak level for the DC value........ To convert from RMS to peak, the RMS value is multiplied by 1.414.

**Our house AC voltage of 120VAC is also in RMS, but it's peak reading is 120*1.414 = 170Vp
 
#1,549 ·
Thanks for the reply! I have a set of heated grips and one 36w led light that I added. I also replaced the stock halogen bulb with a 8.5w led replacement bulb. The led replacement bulb and auxiliary light I added are both connected to the DC side of the circuit. The I left the heated grips connected to AC. The led replacement bulb pulses/flickers worse than the auxiliary led. I’ll try to take some more readings tomorrow. Does everyone else’s led lights work at less than wot? My buddy added an led light to his yard king and he says his led works great even at idle???
 
#1,550 · (Edited)
A 36W along with your 8.5W, those should both run nicely at WOT, esp if the grips were off off.

You mentioned 10.3VDC up in #1545, with just the 36W and the 8.5W on, that sounds too low @ WOT, thinking your stator has some shorted windings if it in fact it is a 60W type, which I think it is suppose to be.

At idle, with both on could be pushing it though, I'd guess the stator will put out around half or 30W at idle and that 60W rating is probably somewhere near WOT
 
#1,556 ·
This is true usually because the stator(in this case as far as I can tell as I see no external) will typically have a built-in rectifier else the battery c/wouldn't charge.

HOWEVER, 160W seems high for your alternator. I can't find a spec on it(maybe someone else here does?) so I'm sorta guessing here.............If the alt. were a 60W type, well you can do the math eh? Your alt. won't keep up and your battery would just deplete the entire time you ran the 160W bar.

The fuse on the DC out is rated at 15A, lets guess de-rating of 2......Then perhaps only about 7.5A/90W is seen on that line. Lets guess then the alt is a total 120W say(it also has a AC out for headlight and grips).

Given the guess work above, I'd say a 40/50/60W light-bar would work out bester then a 160W. Can just tie directly to the battery though a switch........
 
#1,557 ·
This is true usually because the stator(in this case as far as I can tell as I see no external) will typically have a built-in rectifier else the battery c/wouldn't charge. HOWEVER, 160W seems high for your alternator. I can't find a spec on it(maybe someone else here does?) so I'm sorta guessing here.............If the alt. were a 60W type, well you can do the math eh? Your alt. won't keep up and your battery would just deplete the entire time you ran the 160W bar. The fuse on the DC out is rated at 15A, lets guess de-rating of 2......Then perhaps only about 7.5A/90W is seen on that line. Lets guess then the alt is a total 120W say(it also has a AC out for headlight and grips). Given the guess work above, I'd say a 40/50/60W light-bar would work out bester then a 160W. Can just tie directly to the battery though a switch........
Thanks. I'll look into getting something thats around 50W then :)
 
#1,558 ·
If you have a battery then the battery itself basically acts as a rectifier. Wire the light to the battery directly via a switch on the hot (positive) side.

Use good quality connectors, sturdy wire and put a fuse inline/done. FWIW I run two 18w LEDs on my Yanmar and that's plenty of light... no need for overkill.

Regards and welcome to SBF, glad to have you here.
 
#1,559 · (Edited)
If you have a battery then the battery itself basically acts as a rectifier.
Not really, perhaps you meant acts like a "capacitor"? or "Regulator"?

The plates insides our re-chargeable battery's are designed to have electrons move from one side and collect on the other and vise versa. This "movement" is dependent(can be forced) by the polarity of a voltage source imposed on the plates.

With one polarity arrangement, the battery is charging and the other/reversed, it's dis-charging....

So trying to charge a battery with AC as you can image and if you take 2 half snap shots of a full AC cycle. In the first half a cycle, the voltage migrates positive, in the other half, the voltage migrates negative. The net effect as seen by the plates over time is zero and the battery would remain neither charged nor dis-charged.

That is UNLESS you have a rectifier, this prevents(doesn't conduct) the negative half cycle and thus, the net result is now a positive value and poof! The battery charges.

All is a moot point given he has a battery, it charges and therefor there must be a rectifier? And as we've both mentioned, hook'r to the battery and hit the night sky.
 
#1,560 ·
Can I wire an ordinary 20" 160W 12V DC ledbar for instance?
Yes, wire it to run off the battery. My 32" supposedly 180W LED lightbar actually draws "only" 7ish amps @ 12V = 84 actual Watts. I keep a battery maintainer on the battery when not in use.
Image
 
#1,561 · (Edited)
Yes, wire it to run off the battery. My 32" supposedly 180W LED lightbar actually draws "only" 7ish amps @ 12V = 84 actual Watts. I keep a battery maintainer on the battery when not in use.
Wonder what your stator wattage rating is? If it's less than say 60W you're probably running off the battery more than not....Not an issue, just know/note ya might be low at the end of a long run and as you have noted, you can pop it on a charger.

I guess my only concern(likely a personal thing) would be if it is drawing the batt down over time, you might have trouble with the lectric start, but again, that would be a long run and re-starting it somewhere's towards that end.

Don't you just love the "Marketing" spec's(lies)?
 
#1,562 ·
Wonder what your stator wattage rating is?
Electric start HSS models a have large multi-winding coil, which has three outputs, all AC volts:
(1) The Motor Coil, used to run the chute motors, generates 9V / 11A @ 3,350 rpm.​
(2) The Charge Coil, used to charge the battery, generates 12V / 0.8A @ 3,000 rpm.​
(3) The Lamp Coil, used to fire the LED worklamp, generates 11.5V / 0.36A @ 1950 rpm (and then goes up from there...don't have an exact spec for rated engine speed).​
The chute motors and battery charging are converted to DC volts. The work lamp is supplied AC volts and the charging circuit and the chute motors each have a separate regulator/rectifier.
The supplied battery for the HSS1332AATD is 18Ah AGM.
Don't you just love the "Marketing" spec's(lies)?
My sense is that the Watt rating is more of a "halogen equivalent brightness" or something...
 

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#1,563 · (Edited)
(2) The Charge Coil, used to charge the battery, generates 12V / 0.8A @ 3,000 rpm.​
Thinking then with that "180W" LED lightbar drawing 7ish amps @ 12V, "84 actual Watts" that you have tied to your battery/charge circuit that produces 12V / 0.8A @ 3,000 rpm , you're pretty much drawing off the battery most of the time when your light bar is on as that winding/tap sounds pretty much limited @ around 1A.

Thinking that 11A tap/winding *might serve as a better resource..........That's me though, I have perhaps too much time and a bit OCD with this stuff.

*Need to check spec on those stock diode, forward current spec should be in 20A range. This would be un-reg'd output(unless adding a regulator), make sure LED has a controller/range of say 9V to 20V
 
#1,564 · (Edited)
you're pretty much drawing off the battery most of the time when your light bar is on
Yup, that's by design. I usually don't use the lights all that much since I'm retired now and can usually wait for daylight. That said, it only takes about 45 minutes to do my property and the lights don't make too huge a dent in the 18Ah battery when I do use the lightbar.
Thinking that 11A tap/winding might serve as a better resource.
That is already QUITE busy driving the two chute motors...
 
#1,570 · (Edited)
Why would the output be AC.
Because that's what coils in a rotating field make. DC is generated chemically by batteries and photovoltaic cells.
I would assume the motor (chute) would be DC. LEDs are DC. It would be more efficient to stick to DC.
Yes, those loads are DC. The LED has its own rectifying circuitry on board. If you look at the wiring diagram I attached, you'll see that the chute motor and charging circuits each have their own regulator/rectifiers.
 
#1,572 · (Edited)
We should have listened to Tesla.
Thomas Edison is more commonly associated with the invention of electricity; however, his DC experiments were failures. In fact, Tesla’s alternating AC currents proved to be the more reliable method of conducting electricity.
 
#1,575 · (Edited)
Funny thing that has always been the generalized thought HOWEVER, each have their own advantages and disadvantages when comparing to one another such as cost/mile to build, transmission efficiencies, lost factors, up keep, work, hazards and the list goes on. So depending on what's needed, where your at, whats being done and/or what is begin compared, AC may be converted to DC for transmission and vice versa, one doesn't really have a simple "better then the other for transmission", it can depend......

"A long-distance, point-to-point HVDC transmission scheme generally has lower overall investment cost and lower losses than an equivalent AC transmission scheme. Although HVDC conversion equipment at the terminal stations is costly, the total DC transmission-line costs over long distances are lower than for an AC line of the same distance. HVDC requires less conductor per unit distance than an AC line, as there is no need to support three phases and there is no skin effect. AC systems use a higher peak voltage for the same power, increasing insulator costs.

Depending on voltage level and construction details, HVDC transmission losses are quoted at 3.5% per 1,000 km (620 mi), about 50% less than AC (6.7%) lines at the same voltage.[25] This is because direct current transfers only active power and thus causes lower losses than alternating current, which transfers both active and reactive power.

HVDC transmission may also be selected for other technical benefits. HVDC can transfer power between separate AC networks. HVDC power flow between separate AC systems can be automatically controlled to support either network during transient conditions, but without the risk that a major power-system collapse in one network will lead to a collapse in the second. The controllability feature is also useful where control of energy trading is needed."



........When combined however, I think AC/DC sounds best turned ALL THE WAY UP!!
 
#1,576 ·
Ya but... when they were putting the thing together way back when they needed something that worked then. We're talking about an era when they were electrocuting elephants in public to try to prove a point...

A complete overhaul of the current infrastructurd is way overdue, however... funds are diverted elsewhere for other purposes. And when Mr. Carrington swings by again well... Game Over.

Build your own... finger to the Man/live Free. No need for "grid" power for residential (caveats apply)... we have been doing it wrong. My home system gives me twice what the power company sells, and cleaner too.

Something something snowblower, I just work here...

Steady on.
 
#1,581 · (Edited)
A "All-in-one" solution to the ext. Dewalt battery setups? No wires.......Click it on and go!

18" Mag mounted....."7800 Lumen, USB rechargeable, constant on / off mode or 12 safety flash options in both all white, white and amber or all amber color, 14-16 hour battery life, waterproof unit, 78” USB charging cable included "

$89.00 + $10.00 Shipping anywhere in US.

 
#1,582 ·
I know this is an old thread, AND a really long one too, but I need some help with the wiring schematics. After reading through the previous threads and gathering the necessary components, I could not find the actual directions for everything. I am attaching the “schematic components” sketch that I made. I just need some help with the wiring. I do have 3 fuses that I can interject anywhere necessary, so that is something to keep in mind too. Thanks for any help you
can offer.


Image
 
#1,583 ·
I know this is an old thread, AND a really long one too, but I need some help with the wiring schematics. After reading through the previous threads and gathering the necessary components, I could not find the actual directions for everything. I am attaching the “schematic components” sketch that I made. I just need some help with the wiring. I do have 3 fuses that I can interject anywhere necessary, so that is something to keep in mind too. Thanks for any help you
can offer.
Image
 
#1,588 ·